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Well basically what we've said on this very forum when the rule changes were posted here... Gray is being very diplomatic on wanting privateers to stay with 6 slots... I guess they think that's 6 FTR's they'll sell... but at 12 guaranteed slots for big racing teams he mentioned the 4 teams... Indian, Harley, Estenson, Roof Systems all with 3 bikes each unless Roof Systems or Esteson only run 1 or 2... and if they want world wide exposure I don't understand why you would box mfg's out... I mean Ducati or KTM would either have to throw huge bucks at a team or flat out come with a dominant bike... but how are teams going to know its dominant?... hell Smith thought his revised Kawasaki was ready.. oops... as far as going above his head to Jim France... where do you think the orders came from...
 
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I don't like. You win your heats on whatever bike you should qualify...
 

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Well basically what we've said on this very forum when the rule changes were posted here... Gray is being very diplomatic on wanting privateers to stay with 6 slots... I guess they think that's 6 FTR's they'll sell... but at 12 guaranteed slots for big racing teams he mentioned the 4 teams... Indian, Harley, Estenson, Roof Systems all with 3 bikes each unless Roof Systems or Esteson only run 1 or 2... and if they want world wide exposure I don't understand why you would box mfg's out... I mean Ducati or KTM would either have to throw huge bucks at a team or flat out come with a dominant bike... but how are teams going to know its dominant?... hell Smith thought his revised Kawasaki was ready.. oops... as far as going above his head to Jim France... where do you think the orders came from...
Exactly ! There's at least 10 privateers racing Indians now. The last half mile track Indians finished in the top 9 spots. Harley only has 2 Factory riders at the moment. KTM is supposed to come in next year but who will be their rider. It's going to be a game of musical chairs with some manufactures left standing.


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I don't like. You win your heats on whatever bike you should qualify...
Under the new rules for 2020 you basically have to pay to play. It's going to be 16 guaranteed spots for the teams the entire season. A team can replace a rider but can't switch manufacturers.


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Sure take the old school fun out of the local guy with his hack mechanic winning races. Personally, I like routing for the underdog from time to time.

Hell, I am even routing for HD sometimes. Now Sammy deserves better and I want them to be competitive, but I am afraid they have too many other structural issues overall to concentrate much time or money on Flattrack racing...
 
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Sure take the old school fun out of the local guy with his hack mechanic winning races. Personally, I like routing for the underdog from time to time.

Hell, I am even routing for HD sometimes. Now Sammy deserves better and I want them to be competitive, but I am afraid they have too many other structural issues overall to concentrate much time or money on Flattrack racing...
You're right ! So far the only big money player is Polaris/Indian. They say the new rules will increase exposure to all the teams but I don't see that happening because no one remembers who finished in last place.


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I like this season so far. Last year, I would have said Mees was the best rider on the best bike. This year I would say the Indian is the best bike on the track, but those other riders are very talented and great riders too. They just needed a better bike to be more competitive.

So it is fun to see if he can keep moving up the and retake the # 1 spot with 7 races or whatever left. And it is nice to see the Yamaha compete too.

I was really mad at the wife on Saturday. She backed out at the last minute to head over to the Sacramento mile. So I missed the races again this year. And with the Calistoga 1/2 mile out, we only get one race in Nor Cal per year. At least for now....
 

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well Bauman isn't any slouch, but there is 6 miles left... Springfield being a double could make or break either one of them... but think about Indians team.. Bauman, Mees and Bauman 2.0 so who does Indian keep? if Bauman wins the Championship and still signed that's one... do they keep Bauman 2.0 to do real time R&D? is he worthy of a coveted guaranteed factory ride? Does Mees get to keep his sweetheart deal.. being kinda' factory.. kinda' not? does he start his own team? does Harley move up to 3 bikes? it's going to be a game of money.. what other team is going to sign on if the big 4 have 12 slots that leaves 6 open.. and that is if Esteson and Roof Systems put 3 bikes out there.. I would imagine Yamaha is going to throw money at Esteson.. is the cost going to be worth it?.. are riders going to get paid more? are teams going to get some of that TV money like NASCAR and the NFL?

and one little tidbit we haven't talked about... did anyone else notice at the end he said Indian was the only one racing a real production bike... he just didn't say that by thinking that... he heard it somewhere... is the FTR going to be allowed in the production twins? or are the rule changes to the bikes themselves done? "hey they're racing a production bike.. you guys catch up" … I don't think sponsorships are going to be that hard to come buy.. these are major manufactures that are running their own programs (Indian/Harley and possibly Yamaha) unlike NASCAR where teams just get factory support..
 

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I like this season so far. Last year, I would have said Mees was the best rider on the best bike. This year I would say the Indian is the best bike on the track, but those other riders are very talented and great riders too. They just needed a better bike to be more competitive.

So it is fun to see if he can keep moving up the and retake the # 1 spot with 7 races or whatever left. And it is nice to see the Yamaha compete too.

I was really mad at the wife on Saturday. She backed out at the last minute to head over to the Sacramento mile. So I missed the races again this year. And with the Calistoga 1/2 mile out, we only get one race in Nor Cal per year. At least for now....
Mees is still the best rider on the best bike. I really think he will win it all again this year unless there’s team orders.


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Mees is still the best rider on the best bike. I really think he will win it all again this year unless there’s team orders.


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no guaranties in racing... no factory orders Bauman is the real factory rider... Mees is a hybrid... Mees is having way to many problems... his crash at the Black Hills 1/2 mile was a concentration issue.. pushing to hard to get to the front... so that tells me he is a little under pressure and worried
 
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well Bauman isn't any slouch, but there is 6 miles left... Springfield being a double could make or break either one of them... but think about Indians team.. Bauman, Mees and Bauman 2.0 so who does Indian keep? if Bauman wins the Championship and still signed that's one... do they keep Bauman 2.0 to do real time R&D? is he worthy of a coveted guaranteed factory ride? Does Mees get to keep his sweetheart deal.. being kinda' factory.. kinda' not? does he start his own team? does Harley move up to 3 bikes? it's going to be a game of money.. what other team is going to sign on if the big 4 have 12 slots that leaves 6 open.. and that is if Esteson and Roof Systems put 3 bikes out there.. I would imagine Yamaha is going to throw money at Esteson.. is the cost going to be worth it?.. are riders going to get paid more? are teams going to get some of that TV money like NASCAR and the NFL?

and one little tidbit we haven't talked about... did anyone else notice at the end he said Indian was the only one racing a real production bike... he just didn't say that by thinking that... he heard it somewhere... is the FTR going to be allowed in the production twins? or are the rule changes to the bikes themselves done? "hey they're racing a production bike.. you guys catch up" … I don't think sponsorships are going to be that hard to come buy.. these are major manufactures that are running their own programs (Indian/Harley and possibly Yamaha) unlike NASCAR where teams just get factory support..
I caught that too about Indians being production bikes but I think he got mixed up.Right now the Indians and maybe the Yamahas are purpose built race bikes. Indian still doesn’t have a 750 for the street. Harleys 750 can race in both twin series with some tweaking to match the series.


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Discussion Starter #13
no guaranties in racing... no factory orders Bauman is the real factory rider... Mees is a hybrid... Mees is having way to many problems... his crash at the Black Hills 1/2 mile was a concentration issue.. pushing to hard to get to the front... so that tells me he is a little under pressure and worried
The commentators said his rear tire went flat.


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yeah but they didn't change it... I think they were guessing.. if it was really flat (I'll have to watch it again) then Indian is doing something with their rear tires that no one else is... because Bauman has had issues with flat tires..
 
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I caught that too about Indians being production bikes but I think he got mixed up.Right now the Indians and maybe the Yamahas are purpose built race bikes. Indian still doesn’t have a 750 for the street. Harleys 750 can race in both twin series with some tweaking to match the series.


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The bikes in the Super Twins look the same, but they have different engines. H-D went the Indian route and made a purpose built engine this year with the new rules that went in to effect in 2019. All you have to do is compare pics from 2018 and 2019, or look at the block on the production vs. Super Twins and it's easy to see they went a different direction this year for the engine.
 

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The bikes in the Super Twins look the same, but they have different engines. H-D went the Indian route and made a purpose built engine this year with the new rules that went in to effect in 2019. All you have to do is compare pics from 2018 and 2019, or look at the block on the production vs. Super Twins and it's easy to see they went a different direction this year for the engine.
I asked the writer of the article the same question. His answer was that is still the only pure race bike being used but the others can’t be considered stock since they’re using racing frames and the stock engines are heavily modified.


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