Indian Motorcycle Forum banner
  • Hey everyone! Enter your ride HERE to be a part of MAY's Ride of the Month Challenge!

1 - 20 of 91 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
571 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I enjoy practicing full lock turns in parking lots. My Harley does about a 19 foot turn radius, anybody know what the Indians can do?

Thanks

Burt
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
571 Posts
Discussion Starter · #2 ·
OK, does anyone want to go measure it? It won't take but a minute. Just turn the wheel full and walk or slow ride arouond until the bike is facing the opposite direction. Measure the distance between start and stop. In general, parking lot spaces are 9 feet apart. You could get a close idea just riding in a parking lot. But a tape measure would be better.

Beary
 

·
Texas Hill Country
Joined
·
4,697 Posts
No Burt, I don't feel like doing it.

There are two Indian designs and the frame geometry is different.
Riders claim that the Chieftain is more nimble at slow speeds.
The other frame geometry is used on the Classic and the Vintage.

I can tell you that the Vintage is no where near as nimble as my Road King was at parking lot speeds.

Pushing a motorcycle around in a circle is different than riding a motorcycle around in a circle.

People get hung up on some crazy stuff sometimes. Different strokes....are you thinking of buying an Indian just to do circles in a parking lot?
The Indian is a very compelling motorcycle that can leave a Harley in the dust in most areas....uh....but probably not dodging cones in a parking lot.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
571 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Big Daddy, you are looking for ghouls where there are none. Don't be afraid of facts that "Appear" to put your motorcycle in a bad light. These things rarely change someones mind and they are what they are. Accept your bike for what it is or you will shorten your life by getting all tensed up when those subjects come up. Facts help describe how the bikes appeal to different people.

Have you ever done a full lock circle so tight that you scrape the footboards. If not than you won't understand. You are wrong about walking the bike, that is how those numbers aquired because it doesn't take account of the changes for lean angles.

The reason I asked is because the Vintage did appear to have a bigger turn radius that the Chieftain when I test rode them. Yes, if the difference is huge, that might make a difference to which bike I choose.

Burt
 
  • Like
Reactions: Roll On

·
Founding Member
Joined
·
431 Posts
Test riding both the Chieftain and the Vintage I choose the Vintage because 95% of my riding is medium to long distance and I always look for parking spaces that I can back into. The Chieftain steers much lighter and is more nimble than the Vintage but I didn't care for the fairing style so went old school with the Vintage. Yes there are times I feel like I'm getting ready to dock the carrier USS American when e parking quarters are tight but I'm willing to pay the price. I have no trouble backing the bike even with my wife sitting on the bike. Legs strong like bull! For that matter I back my Vision without any problems and no it doesn't have a reverse kit on it. Backing the Vision can be a challenge at times because you don't have the visibility around you like the Indian. Neither my Vision nor my Vintage are cone racers and that's fine by me. I can U-Turn both bikes well within the MSF guidelines and on occasion I do practice those maneuvers as we all should to be proficient riding our bikes. In short no the Vintage can't out turn the Chieftain but it still rides like a Rolls Royce. :D
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
571 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I think the MSF maximum turn radius is 28 ft. Is that right? It's something for me to consider because if I can't do a U turn in my driveway, then I have to walk it backwards down hill 60 ft. My drive way can be an obstacle course that is a bit of a challenge for my Street Glide. I wonder how the Cheiftain compares to the Street Glide.

Burt
 

·
Texas Hill Country
Joined
·
4,697 Posts
Gee Burt, thanks for taking the time to explain the facts to me.

If making a U-Turn is paramount in your riding enjoyment, then let me suggest that you get yourself a Uni-Cycle.
You won't need an engine since you will just be pushing it around in circles.

"Have you ever done a full lock circle so tight that you scrape the footboards. If not than you won't understand."

Baby please, who do you think you are talking to?

The icing on the cake?
"The reason I asked is because the Vintage did appear to have a bigger turn radius that the Chieftain when I test rode them."

And you want me to go out in the hot sun and measure a circle for you?
You had a Vintage between your legs and you didn't just "push it around in a circle"? You didn't just go out there and take one for the Gipper?..do some of those floorboard dragging turns that I wouldn't understand?

Oh believe me...I understand.

Suppose I told you that you wouldn't understand unless you were a moto-cross racer....or a long distance tourer with a BMW? But you are special because you have a Harley? Oh, it's because you dodge cones?

The fact that you took an Indian....two Indians ....for a test ride and then you have to ask about turning radius.....? uh......yeah, I guess that give you license to tell me what I would and wouldn't understand.

And don't even get me started on the MSF either.
The words MOTORCYCLE and SAFETY do not belong in the same sentence.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
571 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Umm hmm, i hurt your feelings Bid Daddy, my apologizes. My question was to the list, not specific to you. I guess we got off on the wrong foot. Let's start over, my name is Burt. I own and have owned several Harleys through the years. I joined the forum because I'm thinking about getting an Indian and want to learn more about them. I don't intend to be offensive by asking questions such as turning radius, but I'm use to forums that like to discuss and compare technical aspects of their bikes. While I admit I like Harleys and believe them to be quality motorcycles, I also enjoy other aspects of riding like Sport Touring. I think of myself as a motorcycle enthusiast. Owning two motorcycles of two different brands is OK in my thinking.

As for this thread, the question of turning radius seem to have been misunderstood as an attack to Indians. I suggest the mods close it. I see there is another discussion related to slow parking lot style riding. It's a subject I personally enjoy as I do a lot of that style of riding. I will likely find the answers I'm looking for with those riders.

Thanks and have a great riding day.

burt
 
  • Like
Reactions: Roll On

·
Texas Hill Country
Joined
·
4,697 Posts
It's probably belaboring the point but my feelings are not hurt.
So I am NOT of hurt feelings and believe it or not, I do understand about motorcycles and how they turn.

I believe at this point your questions have been answered.
I also believe than when you rode that Vintage you sensed something about the turning radius...didn't you?
I mean, why would you ask?

Personally, I don't take that as an "insult" to the Indian.....it just is what it is.
Different bikes, different geometry....pretty simple. Nothing to have hurt feelings over.

I'm glad that you have found a niche in the wonderful world of motorcycles.
Something that you enjoy.
The Indian Vintage / Classic might not be the best motorcycle for that style.
It probably wouldn't be my choice for moto-cross either....

From all that I see and read...the Chieftain might be a better choice for slow speed handling and sharp cornering.
But....I've never rode a Chieftain myself.
I came off of a Road King that I had been on for almost 20 years. That Road King was like a jet ski and my Vintage is like an ocean liner....is that plain enough for you?

Since we are starting out on a fresh foot with each other....quit projecting on me....Like I don't understand and that I have hurt feelings...neither of which is true. I'm a guy that took the time to try and answer your questions...You're welcome.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
478 Posts
There seems to be a lot of sarcasm popping back and forth on this thread, so I want you to know up front that none is intended in this question, but I'd appreciate your explaining this if you don't mind...

"And don't even get me started on the MSF either.
The words MOTORCYCLE and SAFETY do not belong in the same sentence."
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
191 Posts
O
k

t
h
en
,

b
u
y

a
C
h
I
e
f
t
a
I
n
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
958 Posts
well just out of curiosity yesterday I tried turning aroujnd on a standard two lane country road. Maybe I went too slow, but it takes almost the whole road to turn around and that would be what 20 ft ? I knew from previous tries it would take that much, I suppose you could do it shorter by leaning farther and going faster. I tried at a crawling speed
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
478 Posts
If you watch Palladino's video you will see that on a U-turn he travels down the edge of what would be the road, then makes a wide dip to the left then back to the right. As soon as his front wheel approaches the "green cone" he immediately turns his head and the bike as far behind him as he can and never glances at the side even for a second, ever. If you do glance, even just with the eyes, the bike will go a foot or more in that direction. I can understand the temptation to steal a glance, that's why it is so important to lay out the u-turn and practice it. That way, you will know before you attempt the turn whether or not the road is wide enough for your abilities... And you have to keep your speed up, keep it constant.
 

·
Texas Hill Country
Joined
·
4,697 Posts
There seems to be a lot of sarcasm popping back and forth on this thread, so I want you to know up front that none is intended in this question, but I'd appreciate your explaining this if you don't mind...

"And don't even get me started on the MSF either.
The words MOTORCYCLE and SAFETY do not belong in the same sentence."
Sure Indijoe-

The only place a motorcycle is safe is when it is parked in the garage.

I am NOT opposed to training and practice but it must be with the understanding that it is in the effort to mitigate risk only....never remove it.

I have been around this racket long enough to tell you about mandated safety equipment on motorcycles. Things like horns and rear view mirrors and reflectors and bikes that all shift with the left foot and helmets....None of this crap has made motorcycling "safe". All it has done is breed a new generation of nanny dependent riders who lack skill and experience but supplement with "store bought safety"....and it's pure bullshit.

As soon as a "good idea" like MSF certification for all new riders gets a little traction....everyone thinking it is a "good idea"....wham, it becomes a law. We are already over regulated and it is NOT by accident. We have the best government that money can buy....and insurance companies have our government in their back pockets.

So, what I'm saying is....Go ahead and take your classes. Go out in the parking lot and practice with cones...whatever builds your confidence level....But please, for gawds sake, don't EVER lull yourself into the delusional belief that you are safe on a motorcycle.

When I see someone use the two words....Motorcycle and Safety....together? I put my hand on my wallet.

Now look, I understand that there is now a whole generation of "Born Again Bikers" who have swallowed this line of bullshit, hook line and stinker. They are heavily invested in it with expensive classes under their belts. Heck, some of them are even "teachers" and "coaches". I understand being "invested" in their beliefs....and ya know what? I'm happy that they too have found their room under the Big Top of motorcycling....Them and the cone dodgers can elope and go make spit babies together for all I care....See, I am NOT so full of myself that I attempt to regulate THEM.....can they say the same thing for me? Hell no, they have the self anointed duty to protect me from myself.....Moral and intellectual superiority is what all of this breeds....The kind of "super citizen" who can and will straighten the rest of us out...for our own good.

So, there you have it. Served up cold and dry and without an ounce of sarcasm.
Can you dig it?
 

·
Texas Hill Country
Joined
·
4,697 Posts
And another thing you better understand....while I'm on a roll...

The compilation of motorcycle crash statistics is the two edged sword that will eventually lop off our heads...all of us.

For the past two decades every newspaper or news account of a motorcycle fatality has included a tag line to indicate if the rider was wearing a helmet or not. This is NOT innocent fact reporting. It is meant to plant the seed in the mind of the American public that not wearing helmets is killing bikers....So....we must enact laws to restrict their freedoms....ya know, since we are so much smarter and better informed....we need to be making these kinds of decisions...not riders.

I don't know if you have notice but lately this tag line has shifted from helmets to the age of the rider. Oh yeah, old people (anyone over 40) is NOT SAFE on a motorcycle.
Hey, you paying attention? Are they talking about you? They are damn sure talking about me.
The fallout of this little record keeping exercise will be increased insurance premiums for all of us old codgers....if we are lucky.

They need to get their damn nose out of our business and keep it out.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
65 Posts
Just went out on Chief classic. And did about 6 loops in front of my house. Got out my tape measure came up with 20 to 21 feet approx. That is riding slow with feet down. Not the most scientific test. But I hope that helps. Except now my neighbors think I'm crazy. It's a big bike but you get used to it. My 77 Electra-Glide 1200 or 73 BSA 500 will do better but shorter wheelbase. As will the Chieftain. Classic wheelbase two inches longer than Goldwing Four longer than Ultra Classic at 68.1 inches.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
156 Posts
I've ridden a bit since I started 48 years ago, including 48 states in 9 days on a Victory Crossroads and 1500 miles under 24 hours on my Chieftain. I still practice u-turns, figure 8's, and emergency stops. I've been in two serious wrecks, both times by cagers who failed to yield the right of way. Yes, motorcycling is inherently dangerous, but practice makes me more proficient and there is no substitute for muscle memory when quick decisions are the only way to avoid an accident. I never took a MSF class until last fall. It made me a better rider and I highly recommend that everyone voluntarily attend this training. As a Libertarian, I don't like government interference, but I also don't have any respect for dealers who sell motorcycles to people who don't have a clue how to ride. I am lucky to have survived all these years without any training. I am willing to admit that I was not capable of teaching myself everything that needs to be learned. If someone had required me to get training before riding, I just might have avoided the wrecks and the pain. It seems a bit odd that cage drivers receive on the road training, but anyone with cash can jump on a motorcycle and drive it off the dealer's lot. New riders should be welcomed to the sport and we old guys should be responsible enough to serve as a warning that training, respect for the machine, and practice can reduce the danger. I have no problem saying safety and motorcycle in the same sentence. There is much that can be done to make an unsafe activity less unsafe.
 

·
Original member / Distinguished
Joined
·
5,829 Posts
Kinda weird how this thread started but did finally get going. I maybe reading more into it then, but it would seem because of the demands police put on the motorcycles, an Indian will never be high on their list for possible fleet purchase. True?
 
1 - 20 of 91 Posts
Top