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I just got done reading about the sportster s and this is my 2¢. On paper it sounds like a hell of a ride, in regards to performance. The seat and riding position look like they’d be painful after a few miles. If I had the dough I’d consider it, to add but not replace my scout.

Personally I don’t think it resembles a sportster except for it being a v twin, the tank capacity/ its modern updated peanut like shape, the turn signals shape/ size, the size of the bike, the forward foot controls, and that they call it a sportster. So beyond that it doesn’t look, perform ie lean angle (I assume), or ride ie the feel (I assume) like a sportster. I think it should’ve just been a new model. Then again that didn’t work out so well for them with the V-rod. I’m not comparing the vrod to a sportster, two very different beast, just pointing out change in the H-D community hasn’t been that accepting of change even if it’s to make a better bike.

I think the exhaust is god awful looking, even if they did make it a whole new model vs them keeping in the sportster family. (I read elsewhere about they were killing the sportster outside the USA due to emissions). I think The trask 2-1 exhaust for the scout would suit it much better. The other thing I’d do is put mid if not rear foot controls because this thing would look better and ride better, the bike says performance vtwin and foward foot controls on it seems dumb imo.

if I look at it, past the exhaust, it looks like a good looking performance vtwin but if I look at it like a sportster it looks ugly af.

I hope they sale well, I assume they will, my only worry is the hard headed H-D riders are going to treat it like they did the v rod because of its styling. However riders closer to my age and younger aren’t as bad with change and accepting it (some older ‘cats’ are fine with change too), especially when it’s for better/ more performance and reliability. I do prefer the retro styling of my scout though and I can live with or without the new tech (like The speedo), both the scout and sportsters need more fuel capacity though.

I hope this makes indian make a more performance oriented scout but keeps the retro look. I’d Want more lean angle, more fuel capacity, take or leave the new speedo (nav is the only big draw for me personally), bigger displacement (or at the very least a big bore kit). I don’t think any of my wish list will happen though, because I don’t see the sportster S as in competition with the scout really, they’re too different of bikes. The old sportsters are only really comparable to the scout in their retro styling and size imo.

I can’t afford any new or old bike, so ultimately it really doesn’t matter for me. I’d definitely take the sportster s for a rip though! (If I could afford it I’d definitely pick it over the live wire even if the LW was cheaper) this new sportster s is the direction H-D needs to go with though. In regards to the price tag I think it’s pretty fair for what you get compared to the other sportster trims at a similar price point. Still a little high imo but by no means ridiculous like other models. (Anything over 20k for a motorcycle is ridiculous to me. 15k being my realistically/ can barley afford to finance after tag, tax, and title. Even if I had the money to blow I wouldn’t buy a motorcycle for 25k and up, especially for a stock one I don’t care what features it has or who makes it or how fast it can go. It’d have to float on water and fly too, for those prices!!!)
Ummm...that's more than 2 cents...😜
 

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2019 FTR 1200
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I find it pretty easy to play devil's advocate for this bike, I honestly think H-D have done a pretty good job with it, time will tell though.

I love the Scout and the FTR as much as anyone else here, I've owned both and would buy both again, but to claim that this is ripping off Polaris/Indian models is silly. Harley has tried all of this before, long before Polaris. Even the styling is Harley-Davidson, maybe not your favorite models, but it's clearly pulling DNA from the Fat Bob, XR1200, and V-Rod.

642403


The front end screams Fat Bob. Steep upside down forks with short/wide bars, a fat front tire, and the funky LED bar headlight. Might not be your cup of tea, but it is unmistakably modern Harley. The rear end, being a monoshock, also pulls from the Softail lineup at large. Smart choice that should result in pretty great handling.

Single disc front end might end up working fine but it's still going to get heavy criticism from the press.

642402


The guts are an improvement upon both the Revolution (V-Rod) and the Revolution X (Street Rod) motor designs. Same V-angle, same similar valve train, same goals, better execution.

642404


642405


The rear fender, tank shape, and high pipes come from the Sportster XR1200, XG750R, and XR750.

642406


642409


Liquid cooled DOHC engines are in.

LED headlights are in.

Fancy digital dashes are in.

Upside down forks are in.

Tracker styling is in.

Harley has taken a bunch of things that are popular in modern motorcycle design, crammed them into a new platform, and slapped a fat price tag on it. I have no idea if it's going to sell, I won't be buying one, but I am sure as hell glad to see Harley-Davidson trying.
 

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"The guts are an improvement upon both the Revolution (V-Rod) and the Revolution X (Street Rod) motor designs. Same V-angle, same valve train, same goals, better execution. "

I'd say a superior valve train compared to VRod. This new engine has hydraulic setup. No adjustment required (I'm assuming here based on Pan America). That's a big deal. Plus it's a six speed, again, a nice feature.
 

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2019 FTR 1200
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1,303 Posts
"The guts are an improvement upon both the Revolution (V-Rod) and the Revolution X (Street Rod) motor designs. Same V-angle, same valve train, same goals, better execution. "

I'd say a superior valve train compared to VRod. This new engine has hydraulic setup. No adjustment required (I'm assuming here based on Pan America). That's a big deal. Plus it's a six speed, again, a nice feature.
Yeah hopefully. My understanding is that the goal of shim-under-bucket (Revolution X) and/or graded tappet (Indian Scout, FTR) designs is to achieve higher redline and valvetrain weight reduction. Harley seem to be achieving higher power and the same redline (~9000 RPM) with hydraulic valve lash adjusters, if it proves reliable that's a win. The CB750 Nighthawk used a similar design in the 90s, not sure how well it worked for them.
 

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"The guts are an improvement upon both the Revolution (V-Rod) and the Revolution X (Street Rod) motor designs. Same V-angle, same valve train, same goals, better execution. "

I'd say a superior valve train compared to VRod. This new engine has hydraulic setup. No adjustment required (I'm assuming here based on Pan America). That's a big deal. Plus it's a six speed, again, a nice feature.
Plus is has VVT carried over from the Pan America

Sent from my SM-G996U using Tapatalk
 

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I find it pretty easy to play devil's advocate for this bike, I honestly think H-D have done a pretty good job with it, time will tell though.

I love the Scout and the FTR as much as anyone else here, I've owned both and would buy both again, but to claim that this is ripping off Polaris/Indian models is silly. Harley has tried all of this before, long before Polaris. Even the styling is Harley-Davidson, maybe not your favorite models, but it's clearly pulling DNA from the Fat Bob, XR1200, and V-Rod.

View attachment 642403

The front end screams Fat Bob. Steep upside down forks with short/wide bars, a fat front tire, and the funky LED bar headlight. Might not be your cup of tea, but it is unmistakably modern Harley. The rear end, being a monoshock, also pulls from the Softail lineup at large. Smart choice that should result in pretty great handling.

Single disc front end might end up working fine but it's still going to get heavy criticism from the press.

View attachment 642402

The guts are an improvement upon both the Revolution (V-Rod) and the Revolution X (Street Rod) motor designs. Same V-angle, same similar valve train, same goals, better execution.

View attachment 642404

View attachment 642405

The rear fender, tank shape, and high pipes come from the Sportster XR1200, XG750R, and XR750.

View attachment 642406

View attachment 642409

Liquid cooled DOHC engines are in.

LED headlights are in.

Fancy digital dashes are in.

Upside down forks are in.

Tracker styling is in.

Harley has taken a bunch of things that are popular in modern motorcycle design, crammed them into a new platform, and slapped a fat price tag on it. I have no idea if it's going to sell, I won't be buying one, but I am sure as hell glad to see Harley-Davidson trying.
Yeah, that is the biggest problem is the price. Too steep for the younger market. Hopefully the have other versions that are more market friendly. Dean
 

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Looks like they used a lot of cues from the Scout Bobber - except it’s almost double the price. I think they’re depending on Daddy HD Rider to buy Junior HD Rider’s first Harley for him/her.
Two big drawbacks to me are 2” of rear mono shock travel (may as well be riding a rigid), and the location of the exhaust. Enjoy that in traffic on a hot summer day. Better be ready to “backpack” anything you pick up on the way home.
Step in the right direction, but the path goes directly through the savings account.

I think Indian was already gearing up for the performance challenge - if I read into my questionnaire correctly. Guessing the Scout will get a beefed up level before the 2023 model year with a $1200 base price increase attached. Thinking the Chief 4” display will be an option as well.
 

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2019 FTR 1200
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Here are some ideas for the 2022 Scout platform:

Leave the Scout 60 lineup priced and spec'd as is, maybe a few modest upgrades, but release the 2022 models with the Scout 69 fuel map, properly utilizing the full rev range and increasing the horsepower/torque by 25%.

For the Scout 69 and Bobber lineup, modest suspension upgrades, find a way to bump up the horsepower/torque a bit, keep the price close to where it's already at.

To compete with the Sportster S, release a new Scout and raise the trim/price ceiling, maybe this is the "Scout Rogue" we've heard about. Fancy Ride Command gauge from the Chief, fully adjustable upside down forks up front, longer travel fully adjustable reservoir twin shocks in the back, dual disc brembos up front, and if the stars align, the FTR engine for a substantial power bump.
 

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Here are some ideas for the 2022 Scout platform:

Leave the Scout 60 lineup priced and spec'd as is, maybe a few modest upgrades, but release the 2022 models with the Scout 69 fuel map, properly utilizing the full rev range and increasing the horsepower/torque by 25%.

For the Scout 69 and Bobber lineup, modest suspension upgrades, find a way to bump up the horsepower/torque a bit, keep the price close to where it's already at.

To compete with the Sportster S, release a new Scout and raise the trim/price ceiling, maybe this is the "Scout Rogue" we've heard about. Fancy Ride Command gauge from the Chief, fully adjustable upside down forks up front, longer travel fully adjustable reservoir twin shocks in the back, dual disc brembos up front, and if the stars align, the FTR engine for a substantial power bump.
HD's new engine has four different configurations/displacements. I'm sure they will have an entry level model.

As for the Scout, I agree it could use a refresh. I would love a Scout Sport model. In my mind, the Octane was a more appealing bike than the Scout. Not that the Scout is bad, my wife loves hers. But I would love something with 19 front 17 rear tire setup, fenders like the Octane, USD forks, slightly taller rear shocks, better seat. Cruise would be nice. I'm OK with the Scout engine as it is. To me, it's more than enough for it's application. I'd vote for the forward controls for the legroom. I'd be really interested in such a motorcycle.
 

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I'm thinking a 1300cc big bore is already available for the Scout engine. That would probably be more than enough to level the playing field so-to-speak.
 

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Well yeah, this is the first of many sportster models. This is their MO: they're going to stretch the architecture to as many customers as possible. You'll see a model with a low seat height, no doubt.

 

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Well yeah, this is the first of many sportster models. This is their MO: they're going to stretch the architecture to as many customers as possible. You'll see a model with a low seat height, no doubt.

Factory rider Kyle Wyman said that more models are on the way. Looks like Kyle and his brother Travis are helping with the development of these bikes.

Sent from my SM-G996U using Tapatalk
 

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I waffle on this bike. My goal was to eventually replace my scout with a triumph rocket 3, but maybe this is a cheaper option (with a dealer that's not a million miles away). I can't decide if I love it or hate it lol.
 

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Funny. Seems like there are more comments about the Sportster S on the Indian forum than the HD forum :unsure:
I find the indian people a bit more open to new bikes than the harley crowd who have emo meltdowns whenever HD tries to deviate from the same crap they've been producing for the last 40 years. You have to remember a lot of the people here are would be on a Harley if Indian didn't come along, but they were willing try something new. New is a dirty word to a lot of Harley tried and true fans.

They're the reason the fantastic engine that was in the v-rod didn't end up in other bikes. Hell, I'd buy the new sportster S just to encourage HD to ignore them and keep going with more modern engines and designs.... unless indian puts the challenger engine into something similar with better lean angles than the chief or scout :) .
 
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