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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
So... a few months back I purchased a PV3 tuner for my 2016 Roadmaster.

I finally took the time/courage to fiddle around with it, but I have to say I'm disappointed.

I bought the product (not from Craig, I might add) because Dynojet says it is compatible with a TS111 2016 Roadmaster.

The fact is: it's not entirely true.

I can't find any tunes for my bike on their website.

The fact is that are various versions of the ECU, and mine is probably not compatible. I wonder if international versions had different ECUs? (which I think wouldn't be the case as I know some fellow Brazilians who tuned their bikes with a PV3 - one of them also has a '16 RM).

Heres my caveat:

This is (more precisely: would be) the adequate tune for my configuration:

29002334 VMB8F0A7D0 / 41488CCD : Freedom true duals, Stock intake

(in fact, I have: Freedom true duals, stock intake with a K&N filter and V&H Classic slip-ons with quiet baffles)

From what I understood from the PV_INFO.TXT generated by the device, I understand that "VMB8F0A7D0" is the code for the "ECU Tune Compat" field.

Mine doesn't match. In the PV_INFO file I have this:

Version: 1
Vehicle Model: NGRABEBCGB
ECU Model: F00HM00186
ECU SN: (hidden)
ECU VIN: (hidden)
ECU Manu PN: 4014125
Veh Manu PN: 4016542
ECU Tune Compat: VMB8F0G6G1
ECU SW Version ID: 10SW010772
ECU Patch Num: 4016540
ECU Checksum: DEAA7BD4
Ignore Checksum: 0
Device info:

My tune compat is VMB8F0G6G1, NOT VMB8F0A7D0 as shown on Dynojet website or on the pre-loaded tunes on the device.

On the device, if I go to the 29002334 tune (pre-loaded) this is the info I get (the device is safe enough not to allow me to flash it):

FILE: 29002334.djt
TUNER: (blank)
COMPATS: VMB8F0A7D0-41488CCD
DESCRIPTION: Thunderstroke 111 VMB8F0A7D0/41488CCD
Freedom true duals
Stock intake
Altered Main Target AFR table
Altered VE table (based on rear cylinder)
Altered IPW Comp Front Table (based on front cylinder)
Advanced timing
Raised Rev limit
Raised Speed limits
Adjusted DBW tables

More, my PV3 firmware has been updated today, and I did go to the bike and read a new stk file as guided by the site. No luck, however.

FW Version: 2.9
FW Build: 7405.17121 (just updated it)
Serial: PV00047251
GUID: 0b01d036-f024-ab23-1a26-fd5bc10700f5



The thing is: there aren't any canned maps for my bike, but I wonder if it would be possible to have one "made"for it (say, with Craig's services) or if I just should give up and resell the device, as it didn't work "out of the box"on my ride (it's not paired as it didn't flash any tunes yet).

Suggestions?
 

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So... a few months back I purchased a PV3 tuner for my 2016 Roadmaster.

I finally took the time/courage to fiddle around with it, but I have to say I'm disappointed.

I bought the product (not from Craig, I might add) because Dynojet says it is compatible with a TS111 2016 Roadmaster.

The fact is: it's not entirely true.

I can't find any tunes for my bike on their website.

The fact is that are various versions of the ECU, and mine is probably not compatible. I wonder if international versions had different ECUs? (which I think wouldn't be the case as I know some fellow Brazilians who tuned their bikes with a PV3 - one of them also has a '16 RM).

Heres my caveat:

This is (more precisely: would be) the adequate tune for my configuration:

29002334 VMB8F0A7D0 / 41488CCD : Freedom true duals, Stock intake

(in fact, I have: Freedom true duals, stock intake with a K&N filter and V&H Classic slip-ons with quiet baffles)

From what I understood from the PV_INFO.TXT generated by the device, I understand that "VMB8F0A7D0" is the code for the "ECU Tune Compat" field.

Mine doesn't match. In the PV_INFO file I have this:

Version: 1
Vehicle Model: NGRABEBCGB
ECU Model: F00HM00186
ECU SN: (hidden)
ECU VIN: (hidden)
ECU Manu PN: 4014125
Veh Manu PN: 4016542
ECU Tune Compat: VMB8F0G6G1
ECU SW Version ID: 10SW010772
ECU Patch Num: 4016540
ECU Checksum: DEAA7BD4
Ignore Checksum: 0
Device info:

My tune compat is VMB8F0G6G1, NOT VMB8F0A7D0 as shown on Dynojet website or on the pre-loaded tunes on the device.

On the device, if I go to the 29002334 tune (pre-loaded) this is the info I get (the device is safe enough not to allow me to flash it):

FILE: 29002334.djt
TUNER: (blank)
COMPATS: VMB8F0A7D0-41488CCD
DESCRIPTION: Thunderstroke 111 VMB8F0A7D0/41488CCD
Freedom true duals
Stock intake
Altered Main Target AFR table
Altered VE table (based on rear cylinder)
Altered IPW Comp Front Table (based on front cylinder)
Advanced timing
Raised Rev limit
Raised Speed limits
Adjusted DBW tables

More, my PV3 firmware has been updated today, and I did go to the bike and read a new stk file as guided by the site. No luck, however.

FW Version: 2.9
FW Build: 7405.17121 (just updated it)
Serial: PV00047251
GUID: 0b01d036-f024-ab23-1a26-fd5bc10700f5



The thing is: there aren't any canned maps for my bike, but I wonder if it would be possible to have one "made"for it (say, with Craig's services) or if I just should give up and resell the device, as it didn't work "out of the box"on my ride (it's not paired as it didn't flash any tunes yet).

Suggestions?
If the dynojet 29002334.djt is not password protected, it could be adapted to fit your tunecompat ... theoretically.

And no, your PV3 is not broken but is working as intended. The only problem you have is that dynojet has not produced a djt for your tunecompat yet.
I could look into it later tonight if you like! (experimental though!)

Sent from my SM-N976Q using Tapatalk
 

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According to DynoJet, the problem is the ECU on these bikes has been revised over 113 times with the checksum being unique to the revision. Thus, no one with a revision matching your ECU has uploaded a tune. The next step is to go to a GOOD Dyno Tuner and have them make the tune for your specific bike. Or check with some of the performance builders and see if they have a tune they would give/sell you which would be close enough for your bike. DynoJet tunes are ones they have developed at their facility here in Las Vegas.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
According to DynoJet, the problem is the ECU on these bikes has been revised over 113 times with the checksum being unique to the revision. Thus, no one with a revision matching your ECU has uploaded a tune. The next step is to go to a GOOD Dyno Tuner and have them make the tune for your specific bike. Or check with some of the performance builders and see if they have a tune they would give/sell you which would be close enough for your bike. DynoJet tunes are ones they have developed at their facility here in Las Vegas.
Well... That’s it.

I did open my stock tune on that Dynojet Windows app I don’t remember the name right now (had to borrow a Windows laptop from a friend, as I use a Mac and I don’t use Windows at all, so I haven’t got Paralels Desktop).

So, apparently the only problem I have is in the ECU revision. It’s compatible with PV3 but there aren’t any “ready made” tunes

If I managed to get a stock tune file for the “supported” checksum I might just compare it with my setup (to see if they are actually the same only changing the checksum) and then compare the stock with the setup I want and make it by hand.

The nearest dyno tuner from me is 600mi away and as motorcycle dyno tuners aren’t exactly common in my country the guy (which is actually a Harley specialist - mine would be the first Indian he fiddled around) charges a LOT of money for the job, I’d be better served with Craig’s service who already knows Indians better, even though the service wouldn’t be made on a “real” dyno. Considering it’s a pretty much basic stage one setup I see no harm in running with the stock tune whilst the device gathers data... I’ve been running on stock for a few months already.

The bad part is that it totally screws me on my future plans for a stage II setup. I won’t be able to do it unless I get my hands on a tune modified to run in my bike’s ECU revision.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Okay, just contacted Dynojet´s support as suggested in the thread (and by a local friend whom had the same issues when trying to flash his Scout - he said the guys at Dynojet were really helpful). Let´s see how it goes. From where I´m sitting (LOL), it would be wiser to hire Craig´s services only when I advanced further into the bike´s upgrades.

I´ll post the follow ups as they happen.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
If the dynojet 29002334.djt is not password protected, it could be adapted to fit your tunecompat ... theoretically
In theory,yes... but the fact is that I cannot even open the files on C3 Tuniing Software unless I have a compatible (same tunecompat version) STK (stock) file.

Wouldn´t you have a STK file for VMB8F0A7D0 / 41488CCD tune compats to share with your South American friend, would ya? 😁
 

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In theory,yes... but the fact is that I cannot even open the files on C3 Tuniing Software unless I have a compatible (same tunecompat version) STK (stock) file.

Wouldn´t you have a STK file for VMB8F0A7D0 / 41488CCD tune compats to share with your South American friend, would ya? 😁
pls check your PMs ;)
 

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So... a few months back I purchased a PV3 tuner for my 2016 Roadmaster.

I finally took the time/courage to fiddle around with it, but I have to say I'm disappointed.

I bought the product (not from Craig, I might add) because Dynojet says it is compatible with a TS111 2016 Roadmaster.

The fact is: it's not entirely true.

I can't find any tunes for my bike on their website.

The fact is that are various versions of the ECU, and mine is probably not compatible. I wonder if international versions had different ECUs? (which I think wouldn't be the case as I know some fellow Brazilians who tuned their bikes with a PV3 - one of them also has a '16 RM).

Heres my caveat:

This is (more precisely: would be) the adequate tune for my configuration:

29002334 VMB8F0A7D0 / 41488CCD : Freedom true duals, Stock intake

(in fact, I have: Freedom true duals, stock intake with a K&N filter and V&H Classic slip-ons with quiet baffles)

From what I understood from the PV_INFO.TXT generated by the device, I understand that "VMB8F0A7D0" is the code for the "ECU Tune Compat" field.

Mine doesn't match. In the PV_INFO file I have this:

Version: 1
Vehicle Model: NGRABEBCGB
ECU Model: F00HM00186
ECU SN: (hidden)
ECU VIN: (hidden)
ECU Manu PN: 4014125
Veh Manu PN: 4016542
ECU Tune Compat: VMB8F0G6G1
ECU SW Version ID: 10SW010772
ECU Patch Num: 4016540
ECU Checksum: DEAA7BD4
Ignore Checksum: 0
Device info:

My tune compat is VMB8F0G6G1, NOT VMB8F0A7D0 as shown on Dynojet website or on the pre-loaded tunes on the device.

On the device, if I go to the 29002334 tune (pre-loaded) this is the info I get (the device is safe enough not to allow me to flash it):

FILE: 29002334.djt
TUNER: (blank)
COMPATS: VMB8F0A7D0-41488CCD
DESCRIPTION: Thunderstroke 111 VMB8F0A7D0/41488CCD
Freedom true duals
Stock intake
Altered Main Target AFR table
Altered VE table (based on rear cylinder)
Altered IPW Comp Front Table (based on front cylinder)
Advanced timing
Raised Rev limit
Raised Speed limits
Adjusted DBW tables

More, my PV3 firmware has been updated today, and I did go to the bike and read a new stk file as guided by the site. No luck, however.

FW Version: 2.9
FW Build: 7405.17121 (just updated it)
Serial: PV00047251
GUID: 0b01d036-f024-ab23-1a26-fd5bc10700f5



The thing is: there aren't any canned maps for my bike, but I wonder if it would be possible to have one "made"for it (say, with Craig's services) or if I just should give up and resell the device, as it didn't work "out of the box"on my ride (it's not paired as it didn't flash any tunes yet).

Suggestions?
I have Avery similar configuration. I have an American Custom header, Samson pipes and stock air box with K&N hi flow air cleaner. My tune is basically a stage 1 tune and runs great.

have you tried a canned stage 1tune from Dyno Jet? It may run fine...
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I have Avery similar configuration. I have an American Custom header, Samson pipes and stock air box with K&N hi flow air cleaner. My tune is basically a stage 1 tune and runs great.

have you tried a canned stage 1tune from Dyno Jet? It may run fine...
There’s no tune available on Dynojets site for my ECU firmware version. I contacted their support team and I’m waiting for an answer.


In the meantime, I’m doing some experiments (only on software, not on the bike just yet). More on that below.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
So, thanks to @cmoalem I now have an STK file (stock Indian tune) compatible with Dynojet’s canned tunes so it is possible to see what was actually changed.

Now I’m in the process of comparing both stock tunes (mine and the one compatible with Dynojet’s canned tunes).

That required quite some hours of copying and pasting data from the VMB8F0A7D0-41488CCD stock tune (which cmoalem gently provided me) into a very big Excel spreadsheet, then copy all the parameters back into my VMB8F0G6G1 stock tune, save as “version 2” and compare both stock tunes. (That Excel step was necessary because, considering that I have two different ECU firmware versions, I can’t compare them both directly in Dynojet’s C3 tuning software).

That is the first step, to see if there are any noteworthy differences in the maps between the two versions.

As expected, about 95% of the maps are identical.

I noticed that a few parameters are absent in my stock map, specially those regarding “engine protection”, which probably means Polaris made them inaccessible in order to avoid people fiddling around with them. Some TBW parameters are also “simplfied” in my stock map (I.e. - less columns to modify)

Ignition timing is slightly different in my stock setup, that was also expected as it was probably part of “brazilianization” of the bike in order to sell it here: it needs to run in E25 (Brazilian gasoline has 25% ethanol by standard) and still comply with local emissions regulations. From what I seen in the comparison screens the vast majority of timing parameters wasn’t touched by Polaris Brasil. What was touched, it was touched just the bare minimum probably to comply with local emissions regulations. Considering that I have some friends who run their Roadmasters with canned maps from Dynojet and have no trouble with Brazilian gasoline (bikes still run better and cooler than stock) I assume there would be no problem in adopting parameters made for bikes running on US fuel and emission standards. There were a few changes in jetting as well, as E25 requires the bike to run a little leaner (although there would be no problem in using a standard gasoline map with a mixture s little richer - it would actually help the bike to heat less).

There were also some slight differences in throttle-by-wire setup as well. My map was a little less sensitive in higher throttle load... but up to 40% throttle it was basically the same, I admit that making the throttle a bit little more sensitive might actually please me.

So, with all that in mind, I made a map for my ECU, but with the VMB8F0A7D0-41488CCD parameters.

The second step was to compare VMB8F0A7D0-41488CCD stock map with the canned map for Freedom True Duals (29002334) to see what changed. Compared them both, copied the modified pages from the 29002334 map (which was actually not password protected) into Excel, opened my modified tune, copied the 29002334 data from Excel into it and saved with a different name. It turns out that there weren’t that many pages modified from stock VMB8F0A7D0-41488CCD to map 29002334. Basically TBW sensitivity, ignition timing, a few AFR parameters, a few jetting parameters, rev limiter (from 5400 to 5900 rpm, keeping the limiter at 5400rpm for neutral though) and speed limiters (curiously both stock maps register 193kph for all gears - the 29002334 map keeps 193kph for first three gears - as if it were even possible to reach that speed in those gears LOL - and modified speed limiter from 4th gear and beyond).

Now I have three maps for my bike: Polaris Brasil stock one (If I ever need to flash it back), one based on the VMB8F0A7D0-41488CCD stock but “migrated” to my ECU version, and one made for Freedom True Duals but also “migratedl to my bike’s current firmware version.

Tomorrow I will make some test runs to see what happens. Considering that all the changes were made based on stock/canned maps I don’t believe I’m at risk of blowing up my engine LOL. They are probably safe to start with.

Basically all I did was move the canned tunes from their can to a jar. LOL. Their parameters are still the same.
 

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So... a few months back I purchased a PV3 tuner for my 2016 Roadmaster.

I finally took the time/courage to fiddle around with it, but I have to say I'm disappointed.

I bought the product (not from Craig, I might add) because Dynojet says it is compatible with a TS111 2016 Roadmaster.

The fact is: it's not entirely true.

I can't find any tunes for my bike on their website.

The fact is that are various versions of the ECU, and mine is probably not compatible. I wonder if international versions had different ECUs? (which I think wouldn't be the case as I know some fellow Brazilians who tuned their bikes with a PV3 - one of them also has a '16 RM).

Heres my caveat:

This is (more precisely: would be) the adequate tune for my configuration:

29002334 VMB8F0A7D0 / 41488CCD : Freedom true duals, Stock intake

(in fact, I have: Freedom true duals, stock intake with a K&N filter and V&H Classic slip-ons with quiet baffles)

From what I understood from the PV_INFO.TXT generated by the device, I understand that "VMB8F0A7D0" is the code for the "ECU Tune Compat" field.

Mine doesn't match. In the PV_INFO file I have this:

Version: 1
Vehicle Model: NGRABEBCGB
ECU Model: F00HM00186
ECU SN: (hidden)
ECU VIN: (hidden)
ECU Manu PN: 4014125
Veh Manu PN: 4016542
ECU Tune Compat: VMB8F0G6G1
ECU SW Version ID: 10SW010772
ECU Patch Num: 4016540
ECU Checksum: DEAA7BD4
Ignore Checksum: 0
Device info:

My tune compat is VMB8F0G6G1, NOT VMB8F0A7D0 as shown on Dynojet website or on the pre-loaded tunes on the device.

On the device, if I go to the 29002334 tune (pre-loaded) this is the info I get (the device is safe enough not to allow me to flash it):

FILE: 29002334.djt
TUNER: (blank)
COMPATS: VMB8F0A7D0-41488CCD
DESCRIPTION: Thunderstroke 111 VMB8F0A7D0/41488CCD
Freedom true duals
Stock intake
Altered Main Target AFR table
Altered VE table (based on rear cylinder)
Altered IPW Comp Front Table (based on front cylinder)
Advanced timing
Raised Rev limit
Raised Speed limits
Adjusted DBW tables

More, my PV3 firmware has been updated today, and I did go to the bike and read a new stk file as guided by the site. No luck, however.

FW Version: 2.9
FW Build: 7405.17121 (just updated it)
Serial: PV00047251
GUID: 0b01d036-f024-ab23-1a26-fd5bc10700f5



The thing is: there aren't any canned maps for my bike, but I wonder if it would be possible to have one "made"for it (say, with Craig's services) or if I just should give up and resell the device, as it didn't work "out of the box"on my ride (it's not paired as it didn't flash any tunes yet).

Suggestions?
PM me your email address and I will send you my tune.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
PM me your email address and I will send you my tune.
Craig, thanks on the input but I think it won´t be necessary. I got a "compatible" stock tune from @cmoalem and then migrated the data from that tune to my own stock tune. Differences were really really small (only a few timing settings probably made by Polaris Brazil in order to pass local emissions standards).

I already "migrated" data from Dynojet´s map for my setup into a compatible file for my bike (haven´t flashed it yet, will do it tomorrow).

Unless your tune is for a VMB8F0G6G1 compat (remembering: my setup is: freedom true duals headers; V&H classic slip ons; K&N filter on stock intake; stock cams; 111) , I´d rather wait a little bit and formally hire your services when I´m a little further advanced in the bike´s upgrades. I know you do that for a living and I don´t want to exploit your knowledge without a well deserved $$$ compensation.

For me, it took a whole afternoon to "migrate" the Dynojet´s map (for my configuration) into a tune compatible with my bike´s firmware. Lots of copy/paste onto and from Excel. LOL. I still haven´t flashed it, though. will do it tomorrow morning (that pandemic and working at home surely messed up my time perception - haven´t noticed it was already Friday - LOL) and do a test run.

I´d do it today, but I already cracked open a few beers, so... (as we say here in Brazil, "Sextou", which would be translated as "Friday´d") no more riding today LOL.

Anyway, if the offer still stands, just let me know and I´ll PM ya.
 

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Craig, thanks on the input but I think it won´t be necessary. I got a "compatible" stock tune from @cmoalem and then migrated the data from that tune to my own stock tune. Differences were really really small (only a few timing settings probably made by Polaris Brazil in order to pass local emissions standards).

I already "migrated" data from Dynojet´s map for my setup into a compatible file for my bike (haven´t flashed it yet, will do it tomorrow).

Unless your tune is for a VMB8F0G6G1 compat (remembering: my setup is: freedom true duals headers; V&H classic slip ons; K&N filter on stock intake; stock cams; 111) , I´d rather wait a little bit and formally hire your services when I´m a little further advanced in the bike´s upgrades. I know you do that for a living and I don´t want to exploit your knowledge without a well deserved $$$ compensation.

For me, it took a whole afternoon to "migrate" the Dynojet´s map (for my configuration) into a tune compatible with my bike´s firmware. Lots of copy/paste onto and from Excel. LOL. I still haven´t flashed it, though. will do it tomorrow morning (that pandemic and working at home surely messed up my time perception - haven´t noticed it was already Friday - LOL) and do a test run.

I´d do it today, but I already cracked open a few beers, so... (as we say here in Brazil, "Sextou", which would be translated as "Friday´d") no more riding today LOL.

Anyway, if the offer still stands, just let me know and I´ll PM ya.
There are easier ways to copy the tables over! Usually takes me a couple minutes using Power Core.

I would be happy to send you my tune for that STK and your setup. Just email me your current STK at indiantuning at Gmail dot com
 

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@ubiratamuniz thats the right attitude!

Trying to get into the knitty gritty stuff and understand.

But if @CraigB1960 is offering help then for a reason.
1. It is really not needed to go the excel way ... in C3 copying tables from one tune to the other is well supported ... but with a BUT:
2. You need to pay attention to table dimensions and axis intervals as well ... it is not always a single step when copying tables...
3. It is in no one's interest to keep you with a unsatisfying experience with the PV3 and PowerCore C3 (especially at the beginning) ... there are a few pitfalls and sometimes accepting help is boosting the fun!

But in general you are on the right track

Sent from my SM-N976Q using Tapatalk
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
@ubiratamuniz thats the right attitude!

Trying to get into the knitty gritty stuff and understand.

But if @CraigB1960 is offering help then for a reason.
1. It is really not needed to go the excel way ... in C3 copying tables from one tune to the other is well supported ... but with a BUT:
2. You need to pay attention to table dimensions and axis intervals as well ... it is not always a single step when copying tables...
3. It is in no one's interest to keep you with a unsatisfying experience with the PV3 and PowerCore C3 (especially at the beginning) ... there are a few pitfalls and sometimes accepting help is boosting the fun!

But in general you are on the right track

Sent from my SM-N976Q using Tapatalk
Yeah, I know, I had to go the Excel way because of the different “compat” between the tunes, I wasn’t able to open different compat tunes at the same time.

I checked the columns and rows on tables, the only place where the intervals were actually different were the TBW tables. For those ones I added the values by hand.

All help is welcome
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
There are easier ways to copy the tables over! Usually takes me a couple minutes using Power Core.

I would be happy to send you my tune for that STK and your setup. Just email me your current STK at indiantuning at Gmail dot com
Great then!!! You will be hearing from me this weekend. Thanks for all your help!!!

I’ll send you my STK file.

BTW (not on topic) , what are your thoughts on Kuryakyn air cleaner kits? I’m thinking on getting this one:



I was hoping for an IMC-205 from Lloydz but it seems to have been discontinued.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
If you are still in the market for a good air cleaner I would have a serious look at this one:

Next to the fancy (and $$$) OTB Voodoo intake currently the most promising

here the OTB link as well:


Sent from my SM-N976Q using Tapatalk
looks wonderful in funcionality but I don´t dig the looks of it. I prefer something more of a "sleeper" look.

My first choice was the IMC-205 from Lloydz because it actually keeps the stock AC cover. LOL.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Nice!

So, as promised, an update on the Dynojet support ticket.

Yesterday, about 1800 (local time, GMT-3) I got my first reply from Dynojet staff.

Sent my STK file to them as requested and described my setup.

Now I just woke up and the new tune was in my mailbox. They sent it back to me only two hours later.

Time to flash it and go for a test run!
 
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