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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I have installed an oil cooler (p/n: 2880668) yesterday to my 2016 Springfield and would like to share some info so that might be useful to anybody going this way.
First, I decided to do it myself mostly because: (1) I like working on my bike by my own hands even though I'm not a pro mechanic but I just enjoy the process and (2) I don't like anybody else doing something on my bike or car without me seeing the process and I don't trust the work quality at the dealership.
Anyway - that was a free (!) 500mi service on my bike that was initially included with bike purchase. They told me it will take 2.5-3hrs and the after approx. 1.5 I have looked outside and saw my bike parked in front of the main entrance. I thought: ok, may be they will test ride it or anything so I waited another 1.5hrs after I've been told by the service guy that my bike is ready. I'm a picky guy so I decided to check the oil level and I noticed that they changed it (the color was lighter than the one of the brake-in oil) but I noticed that the oil filter looked kind of dirty and I asked him: haven't your techs 'forgotten' to replace the oil filter may be? He ran in and out and confirmed that it was replaced too. I have also told him I'm going to install an engine cooler myself, how much oil i should add and can I buy a quart of oif from you now? He again went back and consulted with somebody than told me 'you don't need any extra oil, you are ok' and 'sorry, we are out of stock of those small cans of oil'.
Well, the 1st answer was a complete BS and the 2nd was another alarming signal about the approach of running business and keeping most demanded stuff in stock. Then he wished me 'ride safe' and thanked me and left. BTW, another thing I noticed is that the oil drainage plugs at the bottom of the engine were most likely not removed meaning they have used a suction pump to replace the oil. OK, I thought, it is a free service and you can't claim much :) What I should have done to ask them for a checklist about what has actually been done but then I realized that even if they bring me this document, it will contain something like 'all is checked, everything is fine' w/o details like compression in cylinders or list of lugs and bolts that were loose.
Anyway: I came home with the plan to drain the oil, install the oil cooler and put the oil back. There is 3-page a installation manual enclosed (I can scan it and put here if anybody needs it) - very simple and straightforward. The most difficult part was to fix the 2 oil cooler pipes into the 'oil filter adapter': the construction and the design of this particular area is bad and the connection is flimsy. Actually my first thought was: 'aha! that is why they decided to got rid of the oil cooler - because it most likely didn't satisfy dome of the green guys' :)
So, guess what? I messed up with proper fixing of the upper hose because I noticed a oil drops under the bike on the garage floor. After thorough inspection I have found the leak point is the upper hose. Another thing (important!) is that after draining the oil out and put all the same amount of oil back (not taking into account a couple of ounces may be), and running the engine for a minute in the garage, I noticed NO OIL at all on the dipstick! Before oil cooler install it was a little below the threads. I was not intended to ride the bike w/o adding more oil anyway (already ordered a kit on amazon) but I didn't expect the installation of the oil cooler would take that much of a difference.
To summarize:
1. Addition of the oil cooler WILL REQUIRE more than 5.5qt of oil. Be ready for this.
2. Even though it is a simple (but a bit messy) process, pay extra attention and care when installing the oil cooler hoses.
3. After everything is fixed, check for leaks, wipe off all the drops and the floor under the bike, add oil and start the engine. Let it run for a minute or so, varying the throttle but not much, constantly looking under the bike and checking for leaks.
4. Stop the engine and let it sit for a while. This is when I noticed the oil drops!
5. If there are no oil leaks, you are ready for a ride. Be prepared to stop frequently in the first few mile and checking for oil leaks around oil cooler hoses. Slowly increasing the speed, ride further but keep checking. If there is any oil signs, try to fix it by tightening up a bolts fixing the oil cooler hoses but make sure you do not over-tighten them!

I'll update my post when I get my oil kit in a few days.
 

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I have a cooler which was standard on the 2014 Classic and she will take 5.5 quarts and maybe just a good cup extra. Its not that much.

About the 'suction' theory...............tell you what..............some friggen tech would be going home in the courtesy van real quick. Mercedes dealers and BMW dealers too are especially guilty of that because changing oil involves removing an 18 screw plastic lower engine cover under the front. Easier to suck it out. Boat people do that a lot because the engine basically sits on the floor.............about 1.5 inches off the floor and you have to be spiderman to get the drain plug out and then where does the oil go? Into the bilge of course. So its a mess. Still I drain the oil thru the drain bolt on the boats. All have big block 454's. But to do this on a relatively easy oil change on the Indian is inexcusable. To say the least. Its pure laziness and that wand they use does NOT get all the sediment out that pools at the bottom. Swear to God I would fire someone doing that unless his back is broke. In fact, HD put out service bulletins against such procedure. Years ago. The oil filter should be shiny and new and a quick inspection would tell if it is the same or not. Or just change the filter yourself now. Go get a 7137 Fram at WalMart which is longer anyways..............and change it out. Do you own oil changes from now on and only thing I can advise you here is to not over tighten the drain bolts. Thats about it.

Another thought ................and we never did it but I knew those who did. That free 500 miles service wasn't truly free. Its corner cutting at times. Like leaving on a filter or wiping it shiny and using bulk oil from another place. In your mind and any good customers mind, its the thought of not spending 300 dollars for a 500 miles checkup and oil change. Not saying they actually did this but you not being able to buy another quart of oil seems weird. Just switch off to Valvoline T4 or Mobil 1 motorcycle oil which again is available 24 hours a day at WalMart and cheaper than Indian oil.

Harley dealers love to pinch pennies. Especially overseas. While HD oil is available for sale and on display, I have seen bulk oil used for changes and nobody knew the better. I imagine this has filtered down to Indian shops too. What gets me is that Indian service departments are not THAT busy right now and to schmoo like that is just plain laziness or lack of any supervision there. If this sucking thing is going on and can be proved..............can be proved is a tough deal...............Indian should blow all the service department out the door and send in someone from corporate at the dealers expense to change it up and stay there 90 days to get things in order for new management.

If its any consolation and it IS your old filter..,.,...do not panic. Suzuki says 3K oil change intervals and same filter till 6K. Older Triumphs do not even have filters like old VW beetles. I'd personally change it up and then you know whats going on. I wish you well my friend.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks, Bwana6, totally agree. As I said I've orderer a branded Indian oil change kit from amazon already so it is just a matter of not riding for another 3-4 days I hope :)
And I'm not 100% sure they didn't change the filter 'cause how you can tell the difference between 500mi old and the new one assuming the used one hasn't been beaten by road debris yet?
Don't want to blame that particular dealership 'cause all I have is a vague proof like 'oil drain plugs should be clean and shiny because they have been removed and put back in but they look the same as before the service actually started' but I will definitely skip their service department by any possible means in the future :)
Kudos for oil and oil filter alternatives recommendation! I have a strong desire to play with non-Indian brand stuff once my warranty is over (I've got 2 years, not 5 as some lucky 1st year Indian owners lol:)
 

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Lucky ? We got a one year bumper to bumper warranty and the rest is extended warranty with a deductible. Kicker was at first the dealers had varied opinions of what extended warranties covered. Take a fuel gauge for example. Some dealers would say nope........not covered under extended while others said yes. Now its pretty much agreed on what is covered. Same thing on aftermarket add - ons. Some dealers still lie in wait for someone with a problem that did not have required Indian ONLY oil changes while others really do not care. Warranty claims still pay.

This Indian dealer discrepancy will eventually iron itself out and am thinking at least 10 years to get everyone on same page. Indian needs to get tech training established first which totally blows my mind as its an open door there. Looks like best bets are to raid HD service departments of qualified techs that know what they are doing. Kinda. Sorta.
 

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Your warranty will not be affected in the least with the use of the Fram Oil Filter mentioned above and the Mobil 1 oil.

Enjoyed your Oil Cooler install. Did you ever check your oil temp before the install? As a former Texan, I know how hot it gets there, spent most every summer in the Hill Country.

It would be great to get before and after readings.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 · (Edited)
Enjoyed your Oil Cooler install. Did you ever check your oil temp before the install? As a former Texan, I know how hot it gets there, spent most every summer in the Hill Country.
Thanks! Sorry for my English though - it is not my native language :)
Nope, I didn't do the temp measurements even though I planned doing though... I have a IR camera that I planned to use but it's too late now.
But I will definitely publish the readings after oil cooler is set up. Not quite sure it is going to be a big difference but still be better at least for the mineral and semi-synth oils: they tend to loose their specs exponentially with the temp grow and after certain threshold the oil just stops lubricating the metal parts as it is supposed to do...
So my primary purpose with adding the cooler was to add some peace of mind :) I don't expect it making me feel more comfortable especially in a stop-and-go situation.
Considering the heat from 111 engine: I must say it is HOT! Not that unbearably hot but when I was riding with the windshield on, I was sweating a lot even wearing a t-shirt on an every light when I was staying more than 20sec... And I'm not a big guy: 150lb and 5'10'' only :) So windshield is now resting in my garage at least for the 8-9 months long Texas summer time :) Forgot to mention: that was during the last few weeks when the T outside was around 80-90. Now it is 97-99 and slowly going into 3-digit world :) The only downside of not having a windshield - those construction side trucks in front of you spreading around sand and dust :mad:
hitting my face (I wear 1/2 helmet).
 

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Your English is perfectly fine. I would recommend going to a full Synthetic like Mobil 1 15-50. In our racing BMW's not the slightest problems with Oil Temps as high as the 350'sF.

There is an aftermarket manufacturer mentioned many times in this Indian forum that has a oil dip stick that replaces the stock one with a nice built in oil temp gage. The aftermarket dip stick and removing the Cat Converter would be the first and most likely only mods to be made on my new Springfield to be picked up this Fall.
 

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Or just get an oven temperature stick................like what they stick in the turkeys.........and take the oil temp when you park it after a ride. Just unscrew the filler plug and stick it in there for a minute to see what it reads. Cheap way to do it.
 

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I have installed an oil cooler (p/n: 2880668) yesterday to my 2016 Springfield and would like to share some info so that might be useful to anybody going this way.
First, I decided to do it myself mostly because: (1) I like working on my bike by my own hands even though I'm not a pro mechanic but I just enjoy the process and (2) I don't like anybody else doing something on my bike or car without me seeing the process and I don't trust the work quality at the dealership.
Anyway - that was a free (!) 500mi service on my bike that was initially included with bike purchase. They told me it will take 2.5-3hrs and the after approx. 1.5 I have looked outside and saw my bike parked in front of the main entrance. I thought: ok, may be they will test ride it or anything so I waited another 1.5hrs after I've been told by the service guy that my bike is ready. I'm a picky guy so I decided to check the oil level and I noticed that they changed it (the color was lighter than the one of the brake-in oil) but I noticed that the oil filter looked kind of dirty and I asked him: haven't your techs 'forgotten' to replace the oil filter may be? He ran in and out and confirmed that it was replaced too. I have also told him I'm going to install an engine cooler myself, how much oil i should add and can I buy a quart of oif from you now? He again went back and consulted with somebody than told me 'you don't need any extra oil, you are ok' and 'sorry, we are out of stock of those small cans of oil'.
Well, the 1st answer was a complete BS and the 2nd was another alarming signal about the approach of running business and keeping most demanded stuff in stock. Then he wished me 'ride safe' and thanked me and left. BTW, another thing I noticed is that the oil drainage plugs at the bottom of the engine were most likely not removed meaning they have used a suction pump to replace the oil. OK, I thought, it is a free service and you can't claim much :) What I should have done to ask them for a checklist about what has actually been done but then I realized that even if they bring me this document, it will contain something like 'all is checked, everything is fine' w/o details like compression in cylinders or list of lugs and bolts that were loose.
Anyway: I came home with the plan to drain the oil, install the oil cooler and put the oil back. There is 3-page a installation manual enclosed (I can scan it and put here if anybody needs it) - very simple and straightforward. The most difficult part was to fix the 2 oil cooler pipes into the 'oil filter adapter': the construction and the design of this particular area is bad and the connection is flimsy. Actually my first thought was: 'aha! that is why they decided to got rid of the oil cooler - because it most likely didn't satisfy dome of the green guys' :)
So, guess what? I messed up with proper fixing of the upper hose because I noticed a oil drops under the bike on the garage floor. After thorough inspection I have found the leak point is the upper hose. Another thing (important!) is that after draining the oil out and put all the same amount of oil back (not taking into account a couple of ounces may be), and running the engine for a minute in the garage, I noticed NO OIL at all on the dipstick! Before oil cooler install it was a little below the threads. I was not intended to ride the bike w/o adding more oil anyway (already ordered a kit on amazon) but I didn't expect the installation of the oil cooler would take that much of a difference.
To summarize:
1. Addition of the oil cooler WILL REQUIRE more than 5.5qt of oil. Be ready for this.
2. Even though it is a simple (but a bit messy) process, pay extra attention and care when installing the oil cooler hoses.
3. After everything is fixed, check for leaks, wipe off all the drops and the floor under the bike, add oil and start the engine. Let it run for a minute or so, varying the throttle but not much, constantly looking under the bike and checking for leaks.
4. Stop the engine and let it sit for a while. This is when I noticed the oil drops!
5. If there are no oil leaks, you are ready for a ride. Be prepared to stop frequently in the first few mile and checking for oil leaks around oil cooler hoses. Slowly increasing the speed, ride further but keep checking. If there is any oil signs, try to fix it by tightening up a bolts fixing the oil cooler hoses but make sure you do not over-tighten them!

I'll update my post when I get my oil kit in a few days.
Nice detail and highlighting key parts
 

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I plan on doing this mod at the 5000 mile oil change. I don't know if will help but it can't hurt. Originally they claimed that the TS111 was air and oil cooled. I am going to do some "cool down" mods (AC, cat gut, Dobeck) to my bike and I'll do this too. I don't expect it to cool the motor too much but it has to cool the oil some, which is a good thing in my book. It would be interesting to know the temp of the oil afterwords. I've heard it needs to be ~ 220 or so to keep the moisture out of it. By the feel of things when I ride now it's not currently a problem. Dave
 

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Bwana6, is it fram 7137 or 7317 filter, just checking, thx.
7137 I am sure. I use them. The XTRA Guard series which cost around 8 dollars. They are 3/4 of an inch longer and are quite good. Positive its an application for a Toyota or some damn 'ferrin' car. You will see. Its listed by Fram as the Indian replacement filter.
 

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I have a 2014 Chieftain, the oil cooler came standard with bike. They are no longer coming with the newer bikes ?
 

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Nope ..............not even the Springfield. Roadmaster has one. Part of Indians Austerity Program for 2016 is in full swing. No running lights either. No gas gauge too. Just like a cheap airline. Next will be additional charge for a seat. Oh yeah.............one color only for the Classic now instead of 3 or 2 or combinations. Cool, huh?
 

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I was at my Dealer last week, all the 2016 Chieftains and Roadmasters DID have oil coolers that were on the sales floor.


>---------> >---------> >--------->

Live Free - Ride Hard - Die Well
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 · (Edited)
So... continue of the story :) After installing everything, including the OEM chrome cooler cover (P/N: 2880138-156), starting the engine and running it for a while varying the rpms, I turned it off and after a while noticed an oil dripping from the oil cooler hoses connection (particularly - the upper hose). Coming a little back in time and to refresh your memory, my decision was to drain the oil (since I normally presumed it is a fresh brand new oil right after my 500mi service), install the cooler and put the oil back. The service tech at the dealership (I won't be pointing fingers and naming it specifically) told me this: 'If you install the oil cooler you won't need extra oil. We always put 6 qts of oil in all of the bikes regardless whether it has a cooler or it doesn't'. After such 'advice' my faith in their quality of service started to degrade... :mad:
Anyway, after seeing the oil dripping, I was concerned and after waiting till the engine cooled off, I drained it again into the pan (need to mention: I did this inside of my garage which is clean and dust free - well, maybe not that clean as the surgical room but good enough for not being afraid that some sand particles get into the oil I was intended to re-use :D) I have got 6qts of oil in total, including the drops on the floor.
Here comes a big revelation: the oil that was drained out and carefully inspected under the daylight, was dark (like it has been used for several 100s to several 1000s of miles) and contained barely visible but still visible very tiny metallic particles shamelessly reflecting the daylight like a tiny mirrors :)
My first thought (and actually the only one I still have) was that the oil hasn't been changed! I know from my experience that usually only the brake in oil contains that s**t in a normally and properly functioning engine and there is no way that my 111 could shake off that c**p after 20mi of usual driving from the dealership to my house. After that I thought that if they didn't change the oil or just changed it partially, I *must* to do this myself anyway. I wasn't pissed off at all because I expected this. I just don't trust other people messing up with the motor vehicles (cars, bikes, boats) I own. And the 500mi was free in my case anyway. The oil was immediately disposed and dumped at the nearest car shop with oil change next morning.
Yeah and the reason for the oil leak was stupid: I jammed the o-ring that is used when you insert the hoses of the cooler into the adaptor. Luckily, there were 2 spare o-rings exactly the same specs from the old, original adapter so I re-used one of them. Connecting those 2 oil cooler hoses to the adapter was the most daunting part of the process so be extra cautious when inserting the hoses: they have sharp edges! I still believe the man who worked on designing this particular part should be ruthlessly punished but it is what it is so be prepared.
An Indian oil change kit (P/N: 2880067) was ordered from amazon and it took 4 days to deliver it in my case. Today all the 5.5 qts of genuine, transparent as glass and brand new Indian oil was put into my 111's belly and after running it for a while, I discovered that 5.5 qts is not enough. With all the recommended procedures of measuring the oil level, it barely touched the beginning of the scale (where it says 'cold'). So I placed another order for 1qt oil that will take another 4-5 days probably :)
 

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I seen a war bonnet you are selling need one for my painting project , apply to tank spray clear over, please reply
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
ok, after getting the extra qt of the 111's royal blood :) I poured half of it and that was exactly that was needed! Several oil level checks in the next few days only confirmed my initial assumption: if you drain the oil completely till its last drop, you will need exactly 6 qts of oil to have the level at or around 1/2-3/4 of the length on the meter (between 'add' and 'full' marks). And I think I was wrong about that oil cooler takes any extra oil: the only change it adds is lengthening the oil travel path. Can't tell for sure 'cause I don't have a detailed engine design nor the service manual yet.
Also, I'm planning to post the engine temperature readings in IR using my FLIR camera on my iPhone to compare it with other owners, w/o the oil cooler. By feeling, I guess, I can tell it is a very slight change in temperature (it runs a bit cooler) but can't tell for sure as it started to hit 99-100 down here in Austin so now compared to the outside temperature, the engine heat is not that much of a contrast :D
 
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