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I have been researching and trying to plan a build for my 16 Roadmaster for the last couple of weeks and have read a lot of the threads on the forum. I am fairly good at mechanical work and plan on doing the work myself, but i am by no means an expert so i would like some of your input.

Bike right now: 16 Roadmaster, Indian stage 1 intake, freedom true dual exhaust (full), and factory stage one flash. (i bought the bike used with these already installed)

Plan: Lloyds 585 cam, Rb racing LSR pro stock spyder 2 into1 exhaust, PV3 and advanced tuning option from fuel moto, barnett extra plate clutch, new clutch arm from Lloydz.

my budget is 4000 or less. i also will need to purchase the cam changing tools (i will probably get the ones from Lloyds)

Any advice or maybe things that i could learn from based on problems you have had with any of these parts or combinations would be appreciated.
 

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There's a thread going on mentioning the 585s closing ramps you might be interested in. From what I gather the ramps could/should be more gentle. Might want to read up on the stock valve springs in relation to the 585s too.

My disclaimer..... I am by no means a mechanic or pro wrench, and know only enough to be dangerous. Guru's on this site, please feel free to throw stones at me if I'm wrong :p :D

Oh, welcome to the site!!
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thanks! I did read that thread, and I sent an email to lloydz asking them about it also. Their site doesn't say anything about using different vavle springs, so I also asked what they thought about those. If I hear back from them I will post their reply.
 

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I have been researching and trying to plan a build for my 16 Roadmaster for the last couple of weeks and have read a lot of the threads on the forum. I am fairly good at mechanical work and plan on doing the work myself, but i am by no means an expert so i would like some of your input.

Bike right now: 16 Roadmaster, Indian stage 1 intake, freedom true dual exhaust (full), and factory stage one flash. (i bought the bike used with these already installed)

Plan: Lloyds 585 cam, Rb racing LSR pro stock spyder 2 into1 exhaust, PV3 and advanced tuning option from fuel moto, barnett extra plate clutch, new clutch arm from Lloydz.

my budget is 4000 or less. i also will need to purchase the cam changing tools (i will probably get the ones from Lloyds)

Any advice or maybe things that i could learn from based on problems you have had with any of these parts or combinations would be appreciated.
It will be a healthy build, I would guess 102-104 HP and 120 TQ. If you want to really tune it in, consider the WBCX and let RB Racing know you need 18mm bungs installed in-addition to the 12mm. The WBCX adds $600 to the cost, but if you rent or borrow the cam tool you would be close to your budget.

D&D makes a very nice 2:1 setup at a lower price than RB Racing, might want to check into that as well. You should be able to go with heavier springs for clutch as well, though the Barnett extra plate is a good addition.
 

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Keep in mind that biggest isn't always best when it comes to cam choice. The first thing you need to do is define your desired performance parameters. Are you going to go land speed racing? If so you need to design for extended periods of extremely high RPM operation under full load. Or are you going to do 1/4 mile or 1/8 mile drag racing? If so you need to build a fast winding engine with as much low end pull as possible, keeping in mind the specific needs of 1/4 vs 1/8 mile racing. Maybe you want to drag a camping trailer behind you while riding 2 up along the back roads of America. Then you would need to design for torque and durability. Are you wanting to build a canyon carver? You need to build for smooth and predictable power delivery at all points in the usable RPM range. Do you want a bike that you can ride and enjoy for many years and many miles without worry? Leave it nearly stock then. Every application has different requirements as far as engine modification to maximize performance is concerned, as performance is defined differently for every application. You might also want to spend some on suspension mods for better handling if that is in your performance wish list. Just remember that most riding is done in the real world, not on a dyno. Chasing dyno numbers is a sport in itself and I've seen more than one bike that put awesome curves on the dyno print out but was absolutely miserable to actually ride anywhere on, as in no fun at all. I also can't count the number of people who have told me after spending big bucks that they didn't like riding their bikes any more because they were too temperamental or the power delivery was hard to control or too peaky.

If you want an all around compromise that will do most of the above competently, if not competitively, my personal recommendation would be to leave it pretty much stock. Look at it this way, your $4000.00 budget will buy you enough gas to ride 60,000 miles. ;) Mine is completely stock as far as the engine is concerned and I couldn't be happier about it.
 

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Thanks! I did read that thread, and I sent an email to lloydz asking them about it also. Their site doesn't say anything about using different vavle springs, so I also asked what they thought about those. If I hear back from them I will post their reply.
Rule of thumb, never ask a manufacturer or supplier for their opinion of the product that they are selling, or at least never rely solely on them for info. Always find third party sources to get the best chance of unbiased info.
 

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Chasing dyno numbers is a sport in itself and I've seen more than one bike that put awesome curves on the dyno print out but was absolutely miserable to actually ride anywhere on, as in no fun at all.
This is why he is planning the Advanced Remote Tuning Service. It is all about driveablity and performance. Peak numbers have never impressed me, but performance is all about a well behaved engine.

If you want an all around compromise that will do most of the above competently, if not competitively, my personal recommendation would be to leave it pretty much stock. Look at it this way, your $4000.00 budget will buy you enough gas to ride 60,000 miles. ;) Mine is completely stock as far as the engine is concerned and I couldn't be happier about it.
For some of us, that is just too boring! I like to feel the power of the bike push me back when I apply throttle. You can have performance and reliability. I used to put on 35k miles a year on a bike producing 136hp and 142tq. It was a very well behaved bike and reliable. Never left me stranded. I would not hesitate to go anywhere on my Indian, it is a solid engine.
 

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This is why he is planning the Advanced Remote Tuning Service. It is all about driveablity and performance. Peak numbers have never impressed me, but performance is all about a well behaved engine.


For some of us, that is just too boring! I like to feel the power of the bike push me back when I apply throttle. You can have performance and reliability. I used to put on 35k miles a year on a bike producing 136hp and 142tq. It was a very well behaved bike and reliable. Never left me stranded. I would not hesitate to go anywhere on my Indian, it is a solid engine.
No argument from me, except that I feel the power of the bike stock and have convinced myself to be satisfied with it. :p I wasn't trying to talk anyone out of anything really, just trying to make the point that in order to keep costs under control and end up with what one wants, it is a very good idea to start with a clear definition of the specific "performance" that one wants. As I've said before, this is hard earned perspective, as I've personally spent thousands upon thousands of dollars on performance "upgrades" only to find out that what I ended up with wasn't what I really wanted because I didn't start with a clear definition of my goals. ;)
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Rule of thumb, never ask a manufacturer or supplier for their opinion of the product that they are selling, or at least never rely solely on them for info. Always find third party sources to get the best chance of unbiased info.
I fully expect to get a biased answer back from Lloyd’z, it is their product. What I am hoping for is a logical reason for the slope. I am no cam expert and if there is a reason it is designed the way it is, I don’t want to discount it prior to investigation.

Keep in mind that biggest isn't always best when it comes to cam choice. The first thing you need to do is define your desired performance parameters. Are you going to go land speed racing? If so you need to design for extended periods of extremely high RPM operation under full load. Or are you going to do 1/4 mile or 1/8 mile drag racing? If so you need to build a fast winding engine with as much low end pull as possible, keeping in mind the specific needs of 1/4 vs 1/8 mile racing. Maybe you want to drag a camping trailer behind you while riding 2 up along the back roads of America. Then you would need to design for torque and durability. Are you wanting to build a canyon carver? You need to build for smooth and predictable power delivery at all points in the usable RPM range. Do you want a bike that you can ride and enjoy for many years and many miles without worry? Leave it nearly stock then. Every application has different requirements as far as engine modification to maximize performance is concerned, as performance is defined differently for every application. You might also want to spend some on suspension mods for better handling if that is in your performance wish list. Just remember that most riding is done in the real world, not on a dyno. Chasing dyno numbers is a sport in itself and I've seen more than one bike that put awesome curves on the dyno print out but was absolutely miserable to actually ride anywhere on, as in no fun at all. I also can't count the number of people who have told me after spending big bucks that they didn't like riding their bikes any more because they were too temperamental or the power delivery was hard to control or too peaky.

If you want an all around compromise that will do most of the above competently, if not competitively, my personal recommendation would be to leave it pretty much stock. Look at it this way, your $4000.00 budget will buy you enough gas to ride 60,000 miles. ;) Mine is completely stock as far as the engine is concerned and I couldn't be happier about it.
I understand what you are saying here. I am not discounting longevity with this build, but I am also the kind of person who both rides a lot (the weather does not bother me and I live in an area where ice is almost never a concern), and want to feel it when I roll on the throttle. I also love to turn a wrench... those things make this a little bit of a tricky build for me. Research and part selection, and trying to balance all of these factors while at the same time attempting to get the most for my money have made this process interesting to say the least. Thank you all for the input so far!
 

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I am running the Lloydz 558 cams with the PVCX and the WBCX. The bike also has FP true dual exhaust, V&H slip-on mufflers. Indian round air cleaner. The bike is an every day driver in the summertime. Right now Craig is tuning the bike and it is coming in phenomenal with the tune. The bike responds well and runs the back roads, hills curves great. I also run the FWY to work when I am in town at home. My speeds I have hit getting on the FWY and tuning on the high end I will not post due to incriminating the law. This set up works well for me. But keep in mind I am a lone wolf with nothing to prove. My belief is if you want to run the 585 then the heads should be done with a bench test behind it. You should also look at possibly upgrading your cam tensioner when you chang your cams.
If you need the cam tool PM me and we will work something out.
 

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I liked the performance of my R&B exhaust on my old Road Glide and was thinking of it for my RM. And then... I saw a direct comparison, Runway perhaps, that showed it actually was less hp/tq than one of the others they were testing.

Stock 116" with ported heads is what I'm running and liking so far.

Stephen
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I liked the performance of my R&B exhaust on my old Road Glide and was thinking of it for my RM. And then... I saw a direct comparison, Runway perhaps, that showed it actually was less hp/tq than one of the others they were testing.

Stock 116" with ported heads is what I'm running and liking so far.

Stephen
Thanks for the info. I think I will look elsewhere for exhaust. I will probably hold off on the 585 cam too. I am going to wait a while and see if a company puts out a performance cam with a better valve closing profile that does not require me to switch compression release hardware over.
 

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I thought you had to remove the compression release from one cam and transfer it to the other.
 

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No argument from me, except that I feel the power of the bike stock and have convinced myself to be satisfied with it. :p I wasn't trying to talk anyone out of anything really, just trying to make the point that in order to keep costs under control and end up with what one wants, it is a very good idea to start with a clear definition of the specific "performance" that one wants. As I've said before, this is hard earned perspective, as I've personally spent thousands upon thousands of dollars on performance "upgrades" only to find out that what I ended up with wasn't what I really wanted because I didn't start with a clear definition of my goals. ;)
Boy can I relate to this comment!
 

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It will be a healthy build, I would guess 102-104 HP and 120 TQ. If you want to really tune it in, consider the WBCX and let RB Racing know you need 18mm bungs installed in-addition to the 12mm. The WBCX adds $600 to the cost, but if you rent or borrow the cam tool you would be close to your budget.

D&D makes a very nice 2:1 setup at a lower price than RB Racing, might want to check into that as well. You should be able to go with heavier springs for clutch as well, though the Barnett extra plate is a good addition.

I spoke with RB Racing last year. They informed me they didn't do 18mm bungs on our bikes because of a fit issue.
 

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I spoke with RB Racing last year. They informed me they didn't do 18mm bungs on our bikes because of a fit issue.
I would go a different route then or ask for 18mm in lieu of the 12mm. Tune with widebands and then install narrowbands with 12mm adapters and fine tune with them.
 
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