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Hey Craig - just logged my first ride this morning - seemed to go smoothly - I'll do another on the way home.
I've been studying your blog, and watching the videos - someday soon I'll be brave enough to open up the Powercore program, run your equation, and check out the VE and IPW tables - first I need a new PC. It seems my tower is not upgradeable. :ROFLMAO:
Having a hotrod background I'm very comfortable with carburetors and Vertex magnetos... without your instruction there's no way I'd be digging into this computer "stuff". Thanks again for all the time you're putting into this project - it's obvious you can do this in your sleep. From experience in my own field, I know it's sometimes difficult to break things down simply enough for those who haven't been at it for years.
I bought a used surface pro 3 for $150 to use for tuning, and it works fine. Better than my new Mac running parallels. loading files via parallels is buggy, so I will keep my Mac and windows separate. It's nice to have the portability of the surface, and I can just plug into an cdmi for a bigger screen when I want it.
 

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Bloomington you say - I might have to bribe you with beer or some-such for assistance if I get stuck in this process. :unsure: I'm a luddite at heart.
I'm catching on, but still a newb in the tuning realm myself. Glad to help if I can, no bribe needed. For the record though, I don't drink anymore, and it's kept me out of jail. Wadena is a hike, but my parents are in Little falls, so maybe we can get together for a ride when I'm up that way sometime.
 

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I'm catching on, but still a newb in the tuning realm myself. Glad to help if I can, no bribe needed. For the record though, I don't drink anymore, and it's kept me out of jail. Wadena is a hike, but my parents are in Little falls, so maybe we can get together for a ride when I'm up that way sometime.
Oops, mixed you guys up. Prescott is much closer.
 

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I work at the VA hospital - so Bloomington is within spitting distance.
Totally understand the drinking/jail reference - had to do an overnight after my 2nd... :rolleyes:
I work at the VA hospital - so Bloomington is within spitting distance.
Totally understand the drinking/jail reference - had to do an overnight after my 2nd... :rolleyes:
Cool, yeah the VA is super close. Your bike looks a lot like mine, that's a Springfield right? Do you get buffeting with the windshield? I added lower deflectors to cure it on mine.
 

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Can I collect log files while running the FuelMoto tune that I received? They seem to record and save okay, but in PowerCore, it seems like it's locked - and very few parameters can even be viewed, let alone changed. :unsure:
 

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Get a tune from Dynojet, you will be able to modify that one. The Fuelmoto tunes are locked, unless you are going to have fuel moto do the tunes for you. But then you still won't be able to edit them. I started with the DJ tune and I am using Craig's tune lab script, everything is coming along nicely.
 

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There are several djt's that came w/the PV3 - can I flash the bike with any one of those and use as an "unlocked" starting point?
I appreciate the response - I'm truly out of my element here.
 

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There are several djt's that came w/the PV3 - can I flash the bike with any one of those and use as an "unlocked" starting point?
I appreciate the response - I'm truly out of my element here.
I would use only the one that matches the parts you have on your bike. Dynojet's website has the list of file numbers that correspond with different part combinations.
 

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Last night I picked up a pair of chieftain stock mufflers, and punched the plugs out of them and installed them. This was after I flashed the stage one tune Craig developed and rode for an hour or so. Just wondering if there are any adjustments I should make other than logging and using the equation to correct the IPW & VE tables? Also I'm not sure how much flow I'm gaining with this mod, but the sound is only a little louder. I only have driven it to work this morning since the change.
 

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You do not need to combine them, just load the logs files in Data Center. My videos show this. You can load in as many logs as you like, though the default is 16 IIRC.
Finally got to watch the "First log and tune for TS111 TS116" video while at work. I think I did everything per your instruction except I think the equation I used was the VE/ICF instead of the VE/IPW. As I was reading through the other night I downloaded and saved both, guess I lost track of which to use first.
 

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Discussion Starter · #54 ·
Finally got to watch the "First log and tune for TS111 TS116" video while at work. I think I did everything per your instruction except I think the equation I used was the VE/ICF instead of the VE/IPW. As I was reading through the other night I downloaded and saved both, guess I lost track of which to use first.
Just take the time that recorded the logs and run the VE and IPW on it to produce a new tune. Or take logs with your current corrected tune and run the VE/IPW equation on that tune and logs.
 

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Shout out to Craig B, the amount of info on your blog is amazing and my deepest thanks for the effort you have put into these bikes over the years, and your generosity to share your knowledge!
My scout rogue is on the way , and I’ll be putting in the zipper maxflow with RPW Accelerant pipes
Going to go with PV3 and tune with narrow bands first, then add the wide bands for WOT tuning, my question is,
Once the narrow band tuning is done can I remove the narrow bands, and use a plug/ simulator on the factory NB input connectors, slap the wide bands in with the wbcx, ( Rpw has 18mm bungs with reducer for the factory sensors) or should I add another bung and run both together ? And once done with WOT runs n tuning slap the narrow bands back in
 

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Discussion Starter · #56 · (Edited)
Shout out to Craig B, the amount of info on your blog is amazing and my deepest thanks for the effort you have put into these bikes over the years, and your generosity to share your knowledge!
My scout rogue is on the way , and I’ll be putting in the zipper maxflow with RPW Accelerant pipes
Going to go with PV3 and tune with narrow bands first, then add the wide bands for WOT tuning, my question is,
Once the narrow band tuning is done can I remove the narrow bands, and use a plug/ simulator on the factory NB input connectors, slap the wide bands in with the wbcx, ( Rpw has 18mm bungs with reducer for the factory sensors) or should I add another bung and run both together ? And once done with WOT runs n tuning slap the narrow bands back in
It would be best to run them both together, however you can set your Target AFR out of closed-loop for tuning with the WB's and use 02 bypass plugs on the harness to keep from throwing codes. I do not know how good the adapters are for the 18 to 12mm bungs though (I have my doubts). The sensor needs to be in the exhaust flow. Good Dyno operators will use a o2 block that taps into the header with a small hole, but the difference with them is they have a vacuum pump that pulls the exhaust to the wideband sensors for an accurate reading.

You can certainly tune WOT with NB's, you just have to slowly roll the throttle open over a course of 1 or 2 seconds instead of slamming it wide open all at once. This give the ECU time to correct the fuel. Once you are done, just add 3 to 5% to the higher RPM/Load areas and call it a day. You will be pretty darn accurate when all is said and done.

Here is what the Herko Block looks like. Notice the vacuum port for the pump and the 18mm port for the WB. It is a temporary setup for Dyno tuning, however it provides accurate results over a sniffer. The best method is to insert the wideband into the exhaust stream, but unless you have 18mm bungs welded in, this is the next best method.

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It would be best to run them both together, however you can set your Target AFR out of closed-loop for tuning with the WB's and use 02 bypass plugs on the harness to keep from throwing codes. I do not know how good the adapters are for the 18 to 12mm bungs though (I have my doubts). The sensor needs to be in the exhaust flow. Good Dyno operators will use a o2 block that taps into the header with a small hole, but the difference with them is they have a pump that pulls the exhaust to the wideband sensors for an accurate reading.

You can certainly tune WOT with NB's, you just have to slowly roll the throttle open over a course of 1 or 2 seconds instead of slamming it wide open all at once. This give the ECU time to correct the fuel. Once you are done, just add 3 to 5% to the higher RPM/Load areas and call it a day. You will be pretty darn accurate when all is said and done.
Thanks for the insight! Once all is done I’ll have to find a dyno to see what it does ( yep I’m trying to exceed what zipper shows on their website ) I know you have done a lot of work with some of the forum members running the maxflow, I’ll definitely provide anything new I learn to the group! The adapter will put the sensor 5/32” farther from center of pipe, I’ll have to see where the sensor tip ends up in the pipe once I’ve got the bike lol
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Here is my long promised thread for discussions and resources on how to tune your Indian motorcycles...TS111, TS116, Scouts 60 & 69, & FTR-1200. The main information I will be providing is through my Indian Roadmaster Blog, which I have turned into an Indian tuning related site only. Please read and reference that blog. If you have questions or comments please do it here so others will have the benefit of the Q&A. There are no dumb questions, so do not hesitate to post. Feel free to copy and paste from that blog here to clarify any questions you may have. I hope the blog will serve as a good reference for your tuning efforts, print it out and use it as a resourse.

The reference blog is here: My Indian Roadmaster Blog

This is a big effort and I am slowly rolling out the information. I will not be going over all the tables in a tune, but will hit on the most important. Please feel free to ask questions on the other tables and we will discuss in this thread. My goal is for you to be able to safely manipulate your tune and through logging of data, make your own corrections. I will be supplying the equations I have written in conjunction with our friend @cmoalem. I have modified these equations to take out the Wideband portion of the equations since this is to support non-commercial tuning. If there are any Python wizards here, please feel free to modify and better these equations and share with me and others.

Finally, I do not claim to be an expert. If I provide any information that is not correct, please post the correction or DM me. We are all here to learn as much as possible in the very short time we are given on the Earth....let's be kind to each other in this thread and perhaps we can demystify this thing called engine tuning.
Craig, I've been following you since you began to share your wisdom with us on this site. Heck you even sent me the tunes for my 2014 Chief Classic 116 build. I want to say thank you. Not only has my Chief Classic run amazing ever since, but you have given so much to all of us here in this forum. For that I will always be grateful. Cheers- Chris
 

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Last night, I downloaded an 'unlocked' tune from Dynojet, that "about" matched my stock configuration, strictly for the purpose of logging rides and modifying it. However - major shoutout to Dynojet~! With this tune the dreaded knocking that I've been desperate to avoid for the last 45K miles is finally gone! I never dreamed that a canned tune would be better than the custom one I received from FuelMoto (and the stock tune was dreadful BTW). I guess my fiancé is right about my needing to be more willing to try new things. :rolleyes:
I logged the ride to work, and I'll have couple more after the trip home. I'm actually somewhat looking forward to working in PowerCore... as confounding as I do find this program... it will get better once I have real files to work with, right? I have to remind myself what I tell others at work: all the preparation and research you can do is great, but things won't really make sense until you start doing it.
 

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I’m with you, after all of the guidance from Craig, I feel so much more confident adjusting my tune using his equations. So far, with just 2 adjustments, my fuel mileage has increased, it’s much smoother throttle response, and I can tell the torque is significantly increased as I can easily start off in 2nd now and 1st feels almost useless. Loving it! Can’t wait til I get another license and start on my ‘21 Roadmaster
 
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